Funny Book Forensics 431 Trapping Time Traps

[00:00:05] Speaker A: Greg has already made us go off the rails multiple times, and we haven't even started the podcast. [00:00:10] Speaker B: It's what I do. [00:00:13] Speaker A: Well, I just wanted to pick up where we left off last time. Booster Gold, number 18 from July 1987. [00:00:19] Speaker B: All right, let's go, Booster Gold. More of it. I can't wait to cover it. It's awesome, because I. [00:00:25] Speaker A: And we're going to Legion of superheroes number 37 from August 1987. [00:00:30] Speaker B: No, Skeets. I want more Skeets. [00:00:33] Speaker A: No, we're going to August 1987 because something important happened in the DC universe in August 1987, and I couldn't let it go because we were getting there and we were in the right time frame. [00:00:45] Speaker B: So you decided to little time travel. Little. Not time travel. [00:00:49] Speaker A: As I told you last week, we're covering this because, see, in August 1987, John Burns. John Byrne was already seven months into destroying the Superman mythos. Actually longer because he did man of Steel first. Right. And then we're on issues. We're about to be on issue eight of Superman. [00:01:10] Speaker B: Oh, boy. [00:01:11] Speaker A: And. And when I say destroying now, I. I wrote a post on a Legion of Superheroes board, and some people really felt that John Byrne didn't destroy anything. But. So let me be specific. John Byrne, in redoing Superman, relaunching Superman. We talked about this a couple of episodes ago. Skyrocketed to the top of the charts, briefly. [00:01:36] Speaker B: To the. To the top. [00:01:38] Speaker A: And then by issue eight and seven, where we're at. Had. Had. The sales had gone down because John Byrne writes Superman, which is cool. And he puts a new take on Superman, which is cool. And he limits Superman's powers, which was. Eh. And he doesn't talk about any of the mythos from the Silver Age at all. Zero. Which is. And Superman just became Superman when he grew up. [00:02:14] Speaker B: There's no other. No super baby. No super child. [00:02:19] Speaker A: That was probably a good thing. No, super baby was probably fine. [00:02:22] Speaker B: Okay. No super child. [00:02:24] Speaker A: Yeah. I don't think anybody's clamoring for the super baby stories to come back. [00:02:27] Speaker B: Well, I mean, you know, they're kind of. [00:02:29] Speaker A: They were clamoring for the Superboy. Yeah. [00:02:31] Speaker B: Stories. They wanted super boys. [00:02:34] Speaker A: Well, they wanted, you know, Superboy to be Superman when he was a Superboy. Oh, yeah, it does. It does make sense. Like, I. I never quite understood how. And Carl Kiesel, you're amazing. It's fine. But I never understood how Connell was called Superboy because he was a clone of Lex Luthor and Superman. [00:03:01] Speaker B: Huh. [00:03:01] Speaker A: So how did he become Superboy? [00:03:03] Speaker B: Interesting. Like he's a super saver boy. [00:03:11] Speaker A: Like he was a super emo boy, I think, or. [00:03:14] Speaker B: Yeah, well, yeah, that haircut or super fake punk boy. Yeah, the jacket. [00:03:21] Speaker A: He was basically like. His initial appearance was basically like. Like somebody that went to Hot Topic [00:03:26] Speaker B: and thought they were punk but wore a Superman shirt. [00:03:32] Speaker A: All right. They got their Superman shirt from Hot Topic, but it was black instead of blue. [00:03:36] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:03:38] Speaker A: You're cool. Yeah. In the 90s, everything was black. It was extreme. XXXTream. Yeah, yeah. And. And of course, you know, but we're not talking about that Superboy. We're not talking about John Kent. [00:03:53] Speaker B: No, no, we're not talking about. [00:03:56] Speaker A: No, no John Kent talking about Superboy Prime. Today though, Superboy prime will be mentioned in one of these stories, but not making appearance. [00:04:06] Speaker B: Are we, are we even going. John. The John Kent stories. [00:04:09] Speaker A: That's. [00:04:10] Speaker B: That's where he's like back in time, like further back. No. [00:04:15] Speaker A: Oh, not, not Jonathan Kent. [00:04:17] Speaker B: Okay. [00:04:18] Speaker A: John Kent, the son of. [00:04:19] Speaker B: The son of. Yes. No, we're, we're. I want to hear, I want to hear about the, the historical Kent. [00:04:26] Speaker A: No one wants to hear about John and Martha Kent's early years. Yeah. Why not? [00:04:31] Speaker B: That's, that's how you get that. [00:04:33] Speaker A: Because they were farmers. What exciting stories would you be writing? Oh, you went out and tilled the field today. [00:04:40] Speaker B: You know how corny those stories. [00:04:42] Speaker A: Hey, Martha, your pie is great. End of comic. [00:04:45] Speaker B: Whoa, Dan, that's almost too much. [00:04:52] Speaker A: Oh, she makes a pie in the stories. [00:04:56] Speaker B: I. Oh, oh. [00:04:57] Speaker A: Did you read them? I mean, yeah, but you know, I don't talk about PI at all. [00:05:08] Speaker B: Oh boy. [00:05:09] Speaker A: All right. Anyway. [00:05:11] Speaker B: 3.14 so we're going to cover [00:05:17] Speaker A: the destruction of a. The start of the destruction of a very good selling DC comic book. The elimination of two. Two major DC characters. And it all started in August of 1987, which really would have been what? September, October, November. Yeah. Ish. So end of. Toward the end of the year 1987. And we are off on onto that. So as Booster's book was going through some art changes. Yeah. We're going to get to compare two artists you would not think you'd be comparing. [00:06:01] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:06:02] Speaker A: In this series we get two issues with Greg Laroque and Mike DeCarlo. What a. And we get two issues with John Byrne. [00:06:11] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:06:12] Speaker A: Also I want to point out. [00:06:14] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:06:15] Speaker A: Guess who did artists on this book who did or inking assists? [00:06:19] Speaker B: Who? [00:06:21] Speaker A: One Arnie Star. [00:06:22] Speaker B: Arnie Star. The star man is back again. [00:06:26] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, it's pretty clear he didn't do a lot of pages. Also, if you look at it, uh, maybe Laroque's pencils were a little bit tighter than Jurgens, because I didn't see any random, massively disproportionate bodies in this book. Did you? [00:06:43] Speaker B: No, that's. That's. [00:06:44] Speaker A: You're very. [00:06:45] Speaker B: You're very true. Like, I mean, everything in this book. [00:06:47] Speaker A: I will say off the top. [00:06:49] Speaker B: I usually save it for the end, but off the top looked really good. [00:06:56] Speaker A: This book, I need to take it out of the plastic. Yeah, that is Steve Lytle cover, too. So if. Rest in peace, Steve. If you weren't a big Steve Lytle fan, there's something wrong with you. He drew what X Factor, right? [00:07:12] Speaker B: Yeah, I think. Yeah. [00:07:13] Speaker A: And. And Legion. And he couldn't draw fast enough. So he did a lot of cut. He did tons of covers. I mean, Steve Lytle was. Covers everywhere. Even. Even up into the. Even up into the 2000 teens. [00:07:29] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:07:29] Speaker A: And just doing. Still doing covers all the time. I mean, this cover is absolutely beautiful. [00:07:35] Speaker B: It's so cool. It looks so cool. [00:07:39] Speaker A: You've got Superboy flying out of the Smallville sign. You've got down at the bottom. If you're not familiar with the Legion, there are a lot of characters, so I'll do my best. Like we do every time we do a Legion story, but we've got Cosmic Boy on the COVID We've got Brainiac 5. We've got Night Girl, who is a member of the Legion of Substitute Heroes, but she is also Cosmic Boy's girlfriend. You have Mon El and you have Ultra Boy. And before we get into this, I want to place in time this a little bit. So remember how Greg and I were talking about that Legends thing that happened? And during Legends, Cosmic Boy goes back in time with Night Girl because he's a historian and he wants to go on vacation in the 1980s. [00:08:25] Speaker B: Ah, yes. [00:08:26] Speaker A: Ah, okay. Well, he gets back there and he discovers that Superman does not know who he is. And this is quite disturbing. Said Superboy flew into the future and hung out with the Legion of Superheroes, and then Superman saw them too. And so how could Superman not know who he is? So at the end of his miniseries, he goes back to try to go back to the future, and the Time Trapper grabs his time bubble. [00:08:57] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:08:57] Speaker A: And basically tells him, I'm putting you back in the future. I'm crushing your time bubble. And if the Legion tries to travel in time again, they'll be Sorry. [00:09:08] Speaker B: Oh, no, not the Time Trapper. [00:09:12] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, it's very interesting because there are some parallels to right now. So the Time Trapper is all over the DC Universe right now. It's interesting. The Time Trapper is always wearing a big purple hood, so you don't know who he is. The Time Trapper, in this case in the current DC timeline is Doomsday. It's Doomsday, but Doomsday because he's immortal, basically. So Doomsday, it just goes into the future, gets skinnier, and then becomes a Time Trapper. [00:09:38] Speaker B: I see. [00:09:40] Speaker A: And so this has been all over the place. Also, if you're reading right now, you know, crypto is all over the place in DC Comics. [00:09:47] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:09:49] Speaker A: Supergirl a lot. You have Superman, who at one point was Superboy. Because in Action Comics last month. [00:09:57] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:09:59] Speaker A: We got the story of Pete Ross retelling and. And how he found out about Clark's identity, dual identity, and was all. He was all emo about it in that story written by Mark Wade about, why did my best friend trust me and da, da, da, da. And then he discovers throughout the story that, oh, he didn't tell me because it would endanger people. Aha. It's really important for me to keep his secret. [00:10:23] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:24] Speaker A: Now, if you don't know, Mark Waid, huge Legion of Superheroes fan, huge Superman Mythos fan. And one more story. Mark had to wait. What year is this? Almost 40 years. [00:10:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:39] Speaker A: He had to wait 39 years to get to reintroduce the. That into the mythos. [00:10:46] Speaker B: Oh, wow. [00:10:46] Speaker A: But when he could, he did. He brought back the original Pete Ross. So you'll see I. I'm introducing some of these things now because the. The reason I picked these stories is we're not always timely. [00:10:57] Speaker B: But we are now. [00:10:59] Speaker A: But we are this time. [00:11:00] Speaker B: Holy cow. [00:11:02] Speaker A: All these things are happening in the DC universe. And so if you are reading DC Comics, Jason, Listener. Jason right now, and others that have shared that with us. But I know Jason is we. I. Greg did not. But Greg wanted to keep reading Booster Gold. Yeah. I wanted to bring this in just to show you. I'll let you be the judge, but kind of show you. And Greg can chime in on this as we go. As a writer and editor himself, how much editorial decisions can actually impact intellectual property, impact lines of comics. And as I was just saying, mark Wade weighted 39 years. Years to fix a point in time back to what it was before. [00:11:52] Speaker B: That's crazy. [00:11:55] Speaker A: And. And that reading that book is really why I ask you if we could do this. Because I had seen the Time Trapper there. I'd seen the Superman stories. Really. Actually, Scott Snider, shout out to. You don't always like your stuff, but dcko, I liked it. I did. I thoroughly enjoyed. Was exactly what it was supposed to be. It was like. It was like if you were doing Street Fighter with DC characters, I guess you could just call that DC game, not Street Fighter. [00:12:26] Speaker B: What. [00:12:27] Speaker A: Anyway. But if you were doing that and then, you know. But you had a storyline to it, and it was fun and I liked it. And it had some twists and turns along the way. And we had Darkseid fighting Superman at the end. How cool is that? [00:12:43] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:44] Speaker A: Never seen that before. [00:12:45] Speaker B: Wow. [00:12:47] Speaker A: And they're fighting. It's like shaking universes. It was kind of awesome. [00:12:52] Speaker B: Universe shaking. People feel it all over the place. So. [00:12:57] Speaker A: But with. But there's a dark Legion running around. [00:13:00] Speaker B: Oh, my Dark sides. [00:13:02] Speaker A: Legion running around. There's. We had the. We have. Of course, the Mark Waid is taking over Action Comics, so is, you know, restoring some of the mythos there. We've got all sorts of fun stuff with Superman stuff. We've got Dan Slott doing a Superman book right now that's kind of sitting on its own, but it's still in the universe there. We've got Joshua Williamson, who's supposed to start writing Legion of Superheroes soon. [00:13:25] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:26] Speaker A: Very excited about that. That's cool. Also, I haven't read them, but listener Jason reminded me that he was also writing G.I. joe. [00:13:33] Speaker B: Oh, cool. [00:13:35] Speaker A: Because you have two G.I. joe books. You have Real American Hero, and that's Larry Hamma is doing that. Right. But then Joshua Williamson was writing the other GI Joe book, so. Yeah. But it's. It's pretty cool to see. For me to kind of see this stuff get restored now. I'm excited about how to mess up the Legion again. [00:13:56] Speaker B: Ah, that's. [00:13:58] Speaker A: Maybe. Maybe if the teenage kids from the future who were inspired by Superboy. [00:14:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:14:06] Speaker A: Have that as their inspiration again. Oh, maybe you could restore the original idea back. [00:14:14] Speaker B: So if they come back with the original idea and then plant the seed, it'll grow, and then it'll grow a Superboy tree. [00:14:23] Speaker A: Well, where'd my teenagers from outer space go? Or teenagers from the future go? [00:14:27] Speaker B: I don't know. But then you get a Superman tree, and then when you got the Superman tree, then all the supermen come from this. [00:14:37] Speaker A: Well, last. Last thing I want to show you is the other link here is that I've shown you this book before and showed You. That Matt Fraction wrote the foreword for it. Matt Fraction writing Batman right now. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. I'm excited for Joshua Williamson to write the Legion, but I'm equally excited about the fact that Matt Fraction is currently working for the company. [00:15:04] Speaker B: That's cool. [00:15:05] Speaker A: And Matt Fraction, if you want to write a Legion book, let's say Joshua Williamson writes one Legion book and then you write another one at the same time. I would be. That. That'd be fine. [00:15:17] Speaker B: You'd be tickled. I. I would. [00:15:20] Speaker A: I mean, you know, if. If. If Matt Fraction wanted to write a Legion book, it. I mean, fair. It'd be fine. I. I'd be. I'd be terrified. Yeah. I don't know. I'd probably lose it. I wouldn't even have time to play the baseball game. You would. [00:15:37] Speaker B: Oh, hey. How are you doing? [00:15:39] Speaker A: Well, it's like the second day, So I don't know yet. [00:15:47] Speaker B: He gets all serious. [00:15:48] Speaker A: He's like, I can't answer it. [00:15:50] Speaker B: It's only the second day. I. I haven't figured out all the stats yet. It's. It's still going. I'm. [00:15:55] Speaker A: No, I figured out all the stats. I just don't have enough money to buy all the cards because I'm not. [00:15:59] Speaker B: But as soon as you sell all the cards that you have and get more. More. [00:16:03] Speaker A: We're not in beta anymore, so. [00:16:04] Speaker B: Yeah, but you got to get all those silvers, man. And then. And then you're selling and buying and trading, building your team, and now you're running the office. Yeah, look, you're playing right now. [00:16:15] Speaker A: Make fun of the baseball game. Yep, I'm going to play right now. Just because you're talking about it. Going to sign up for a tournament right now. There we go. [00:16:23] Speaker B: Oh, my gosh. [00:16:24] Speaker A: Got my card packs for the day. [00:16:28] Speaker B: Cannot stop this, man. He is a bad man. [00:16:31] Speaker A: Okay, we're done with that baseball game. No, I got. I got tournaments running. I'm in, like, the finals of one right now. It's. It's all good. See, but I'm closing that because we're not paying attention to that right now. It's time for comic book talk. So, anyway, we have. We have some things going on. Yes, I was. I was. I was hoping, too. I had heard a rumor maybe not happening. [00:16:58] Speaker B: What? [00:17:01] Speaker A: Well, I heard a rumor. [00:17:04] Speaker B: You heard a rumor? [00:17:05] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm actually messaging said person. [00:17:08] Speaker B: Okay. [00:17:10] Speaker A: Yeah, he heard a rumor. Yeah, I'm just. If not, no big deal is. Is what I'm messaging to this person, so. I understand, though. Yeah. Now he may be busy right now, because after all, he does run a Jiu Jitsu school. [00:17:26] Speaker B: Yes. [00:17:27] Speaker A: And he is a lawyer. [00:17:28] Speaker B: Yes. [00:17:30] Speaker A: Yes. And he has a black belt. [00:17:32] Speaker B: Yes. And a dog. [00:17:33] Speaker A: But Jiu Jitsu lawyer Paul mentioned to me. [00:17:36] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:17:36] Speaker A: That the Squacho man had reached out to him. [00:17:39] Speaker B: Oh, really? [00:17:40] Speaker A: And has retained his services. Oh, [00:17:45] Speaker B: really? [00:17:46] Speaker A: Yes. I see. He mentioned that he may appear to let you know some of Squatcher Man's demands. [00:17:54] Speaker B: Oh. [00:17:57] Speaker A: So while you're shaking your boots, I think we should get into Legion of superheroes. Number 37. Right here, boy. Yeah. And so. All right, I've got it up on my tablet. If I can't keep reading it from here, I'll read it from the tablet. Now, I want to highlight something. If you flip open the first page of this book, we have a tribute to E. Nelson Bridwell. [00:18:23] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [00:18:25] Speaker A: The former Superman editor. [00:18:26] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:18:27] Speaker A: In fact, he was a Superman editor through much of the Silver Age. And I think it's stunningly appropriate that he passed away right as D.C. editorial was destroying what was left of Superman. Silver Age. [00:18:46] Speaker B: It was fine, fine work. [00:18:50] Speaker A: Well, I wouldn't say his fine, fine work. And he may have been a little racist from what I understand. But it's very interesting that. It's just very interesting. It's very interesting that these things align with each other. [00:19:06] Speaker B: Ah. [00:19:08] Speaker A: Also, we do have a checklist on the front. And this checklist. [00:19:11] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:19:12] Speaker A: Is all direct sale books. [00:19:15] Speaker B: Oh, nice. We love direct sale books. [00:19:18] Speaker A: Yeah. What were the direct sale books? Before we get into this. Green Arrow, Long Bow Hunters number one. Heard that was good. [00:19:24] Speaker B: Yeah, pretty good. [00:19:26] Speaker A: The Shadow, number one. [00:19:27] Speaker B: Another pretty good book. Wow. Two. Two bangers in a row. [00:19:30] Speaker A: These are both miniseries. Yeah. You had Bill Sinkowitz art on the Shadow. And of course you had Mike Grell. Yeah, Mike Grell and Mike Grell on Longbow Hudders. But it's painted over. Who was the painter? I can't remember. Mike Grell. No, Mike did not paint it. Somebody painted over his work. Outsiders number 22, vigilante number 44 with Dave Cockrum and Rick Burchett. Art. [00:19:59] Speaker B: Dang. [00:20:01] Speaker A: Yeah. They really did try to get that Vigilante series and keep it going. [00:20:04] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:20:05] Speaker A: It just. Paul Kupperberg was writing it at that point. I don't think. It's not long. It's what, about six issues until he meets his untimely own personal death? I think it's in issue 50. [00:20:18] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:20:19] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, we should give a warning if we keep talking about it. [00:20:26] Speaker B: Yeah. I'm Not. Yeah, it's. [00:20:32] Speaker A: It's. I remember when I was a kid and I had a friend that read that book. [00:20:36] Speaker B: Uhhuh. [00:20:38] Speaker A: That was my age. And so this book is 1987. So I would have been 13. 12 actually. Yeah, yeah. Well, 13 when this book came out. Right. So just after my birthday. [00:20:55] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:20:57] Speaker A: Not a book I thought a 12 year old should have been reading. [00:20:59] Speaker B: No. [00:21:01] Speaker A: Or a 13 year old for that matter. [00:21:02] Speaker B: No, not at all. [00:21:03] Speaker A: But we have Legion of superheroes number 37. Of course, we're holding that. Watchmen number 11. [00:21:10] Speaker B: Wow. [00:21:12] Speaker A: Just give you place and time for this book. [00:21:14] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:21:14] Speaker A: Dr. Fate number two. That was that one art. The GIF in art with no Mouths. Right, yeah. [00:21:20] Speaker B: Pretty cool. [00:21:22] Speaker A: And Infinity Inc. 41, Skyman. So they had already changed from Star Spangled Kid to Skyman. Infinity Inc. We mentioned was also a book massively impacted by Crisis, similar to Legion and other books. Because if you don't have golden age superheroes, how do you have the kids of Golden Age superheroes? [00:21:45] Speaker B: You don't. [00:21:47] Speaker A: And the most impacted characters were Hector hall, the Silver Scarab, who was the son of Hawkman and Hawk Woman. Or Hawk Girl. Yeah, yeah. And then. And Fury, son of Steve Trevor and Diana Prince, our daughter of. Yeah. And so those characters can't exist if [00:22:15] Speaker B: their parents aren't around. [00:22:17] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. So they had to. I felt like. Yeah. Fury's origin got more messed up than Wonder Girl's, than Donna Troy's, which. And then finally the question number seven. Do you know who was writing the question? [00:22:35] Speaker B: No. [00:22:37] Speaker A: Denny o'. Neal. Yeah, yeah, he wrote some Batman. [00:22:45] Speaker B: Yeah, just a little bit. [00:22:48] Speaker A: He. [00:22:48] Speaker B: He wrote. He had his hand in a lot of things, apparently. Apparently. [00:22:55] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, I'm just letting you know Jiu Jitsu lawyer Paul is not joining us. [00:23:06] Speaker B: Good. Dodged a bullet there. [00:23:07] Speaker A: Yeah, boy. Yeah. I'm just letting him know that he. You dodged a bullet. Yeah, he said he had to finish up some non squatcho man arbitration stuff, so maybe next week. Yeah. [00:23:25] Speaker B: Oh no, [00:23:29] Speaker A: but yeah. Anyway, that Denny o' Neill guy, Pretty. Pretty awesome. Yeah. [00:23:34] Speaker B: Pretty cool. So he had good things. [00:23:37] Speaker A: Wow. He wrote things. Yeah. So while we are off onto this book and toy, we get the remains of the Metropolis University's Time Institute. 2987. Something bad went down last issue. Yeah, well I mentioned something bad went down last issue. And when Cosmic Boy came back. [00:24:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:24:03] Speaker A: And it was. It was. It was Bad News Bears, basically. Basically, yeah. It came back and it was not so good. One of the things too, if you're reading this book for the first time. And I go. Greg was the way the books for the Legion are just written into the Legion continuity storyline. [00:24:25] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:24:25] Speaker A: And so you get this storyline, but you get every other storyline that Levitz is cooking too. Yeah. [00:24:33] Speaker B: Like, I'm like, okay, cool. Something bad happened. I don't know what happened. The last thing, it just. This is where it opens up and. Cool. [00:24:41] Speaker A: I'll figure it out as we go. This is what I was setting up for you, was that. Yeah. When Cosmic Boy came back from the Legends series. This is what happened. So I see Time Institute's destroyed, and you've got. Here, on the first page, you've got some. A couple heavy hitters. You've got Monel, Ultra Boy, and Colossal Boy and Wildfire. So you've got some pretty powerful folks there, all working on that. You got Cicadia Sennis, who runs the Time Institute, talking to Brainiac 5. And he's a cicada. Oh, wow. Yeah, it's a. He's a bug creature. [00:25:25] Speaker B: It's a bug creature. Does his feet rub together and make a beautiful noise at nighttime? [00:25:30] Speaker A: I don't know. I mean, he does from the Time Institute, so it's possible. And we get page two, and they're trying to reset up the time beacon, basically so they can communicate through time and they're trying to repower it. Sunboy is doing his best to. We flip to page two here. Notice there are page numbers, which is very. [00:25:55] Speaker B: Yeah, it's. It's pretty neat. [00:25:57] Speaker A: All books. All books should have page numbers. [00:25:59] Speaker B: I know it makes you happy, Dan. Page numbers. I'm gonna get you some for Christmas next year. [00:26:06] Speaker A: I did mention the art team, right? I already mentioned the art team. Right, you did, yeah. And John Costanza's on letters, by the way. Carl Gafford colors this, so. And Karen Berger editing. Still. [00:26:20] Speaker B: Still. [00:26:21] Speaker A: So you recall Karen was doing the Legion of Supers editing last time when you mentioned Legion. And. Yeah. Karen Berger, before she helps launch Vertigo. [00:26:30] Speaker B: I see. Before she makes the jump to the cool, like, cool, hip, indie DC imprint that basically, I don't know, like, held [00:26:45] Speaker A: a lot of dc, probably. [00:26:47] Speaker B: Huh. Saved it. Yeah. [00:26:48] Speaker A: Probably saved dc. Yeah. [00:26:50] Speaker B: It housed a lot of fantastic works for it. [00:26:54] Speaker A: Definitely kept DC from suffering the same fate Marvel did throughout the 90s. [00:26:58] Speaker B: Yeah, a lot of cool books, even [00:27:01] Speaker A: though Marvel sold more. But Marvel was bought and sold and bought and sold and. Well, anyway, we get. We get all sorts of Legionnaires here. We get this really cool panel where Lightning last repowers the entire thing with her powers. Yeah. And what do you think of this art so far? [00:27:22] Speaker B: It looks amazing. It looks great. The art's good. The coloring is. [00:27:28] Speaker A: The coloring on this Baxter paper. If you've never seen it. So these are called Baxter Books because the paper was called Baxter Paper. And I'll hold some of this up if you're solid. Yeah. This book. This is the original book I bought in 1987 that I read many, many times. [00:27:47] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:27:47] Speaker A: And you can see how intact it is, how undamaged it is. Like, it's. This paper was really nice. I will say I mentioned the $50 price tag on these. You did get, you know, quality at this time. Yeah. They gave you a really quality book. [00:28:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:28:05] Speaker A: For that dollar and fifty cents. There's an advertisement for a Long Hunters on the back. We. [00:28:11] Speaker B: We say quality. Kids today would say looks. [00:28:14] Speaker A: Yeah, well, it was deluxe. [00:28:17] Speaker B: It's. It's like you went to Taco Bell in the middle of the night, you got yourself a box with a comic book inside. [00:28:25] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:28:26] Speaker B: No, no. Oh, but think about that. If that was an option where you could get, like, a box with a taco and a burrito and a drink and some of those, like, twisty things. I know what they're called because I used to make them when I worked there. [00:28:40] Speaker A: I wouldn't want to read a comic book while eating Taco Bell. [00:28:42] Speaker B: Why not? [00:28:43] Speaker A: Because it's a comic book. No, it's the Taco Bell smell on it, Dan. [00:28:47] Speaker B: You eat the Taco Bell, and then you read the comic book when you're in the toilet getting rid of the Taco Bell. [00:28:52] Speaker A: The comic book would have Taco Bell smell? [00:28:54] Speaker B: Well, no. [00:28:55] Speaker A: Well, nobody wants Taco Bell smell while they're getting rid of Taco Bell smell. [00:28:59] Speaker B: Well, of course it would. It would. It would absorb the Taco Bell smell that's coming out of you when you're reading it in the bathroom. But it's the perfect double feature, if you will. Or triple feature. [00:29:13] Speaker A: Well, speaking of comedy, because your comedy is going off well right now. Uh, on page four, we get this. Legion's resident comedy duo of Timberwolf and. And Block. [00:29:24] Speaker B: Oh, yes. [00:29:26] Speaker A: And they're trying to carry the time bubble. And Brainiac 5 is not happy that of all the superpowered giant legionnaires. Look, Mon El is just standing there. Ultra Boy is just standing there. Colossal Boy is just standing there. And they let Block and Timberwolf carry very sensitive scientific equipment. [00:29:44] Speaker B: Hey, I've seen Block do some amazing things in the past where he can. He can. He can carry stuff and hold up Things. And, and he's got, he's got power. Yeah, yeah, he's got power. [00:29:57] Speaker A: It is interesting that, like, his power is like density sign kind of too. And like, he's sort of impervious. Right. It's interesting that it appears that Timberwolf is stronger than Block here. [00:30:08] Speaker B: Yeah, well, I mean, Block's complaining a lot. And Timberwolf's like, let's just do this and get it done. [00:30:15] Speaker A: Bro's like, bro, I got this. [00:30:18] Speaker B: Yeah. He's like, I ate some apples earlier and I can do anything. Watch me go. [00:30:26] Speaker A: Well, we get to, we get through this and hear Cosmic Boy and Night Girl make an appearance and they come to tell the story of what happened in the previous issues. And basically Cosmic Boy comes in and says, either the trapper's grown more powerful or he's flaunting it more. Lydia and I only got away because he played another one of his silly games. And the Night Girl, Lyta, says, I wish we didn't have to go back and face him again, but I guess there's no alternative. So they are very scared. And Brainiac 5 goes to twist the Legion flight ring so he can call everybody in and somebody freezes his flight ring. [00:31:11] Speaker B: No. [00:31:13] Speaker A: And that's Polar Boy. Now, last time you saw Polar Boy. Yeah, I believe he was fighting Pulsar Stargrave on a planet with the other Legion of Substitute Heroes, if you recall. Yeah, it wasn't going so well for him in that book. And here he is now. How did this happen? It says right here that he's the new Legion leader. [00:31:38] Speaker B: Oh my. [00:31:40] Speaker A: Did they grew up? [00:31:42] Speaker B: Do they put a vote out for him? And they, and he, he, he paid some dues and they said, yeah. All right, cool. [00:31:50] Speaker A: Yeah. So he joins Legion of Superheroes back. I believe it's issue 17. Ish. So it's right during Crisis. Right after Crisis, he joins with a couple of other characters. If you flip the page here to page five, you have Sensor Girl and Telus. And we have a wrap up. So this is, this page wraps up another plot. So this is what's happening there. [00:32:18] Speaker B: All right. [00:32:18] Speaker A: They just finished a four part storyline called the Universo Project. [00:32:22] Speaker B: Oh. [00:32:23] Speaker A: Where Universo hypnotized the entire Earth. [00:32:25] Speaker B: Oh, dang. [00:32:27] Speaker A: And several characters went away. I feel like we read this on the podcast. [00:32:31] Speaker B: But anyway, I don't think so. I mean, it sounds familiar, but it's not. I don't think we did. [00:32:38] Speaker A: Yeah. And so they're taking him to Labyrinth, the prison planet. And they're sending him to jail. And they're saying reading his mind was gross. So that's a wrap up page. And then we go back to the Time Institute and we have a bunch of people getting into a time bubble to go fight or to go back and find out what's going on with Superboy. They're not going. Sorry, I said that backwards. They're trying to go forward and fight the Time Trapper. [00:33:07] Speaker B: The Time Trapper Keeper. Because if you got a Trapper Keeper and it's. And it's doing some terrible time keeping things for you, then you got to fight it. I mean, you want your papers to be in there nice and tight. You want to be able to get to class on time. And if they're falling out, it's not keeping your business together. [00:33:28] Speaker A: That. That is true. Yeah, and apparently polar boy agrees with you because he's keeping a bunch of legionnaires on Earth based on what? Earth government has told him to help defend the universe against other threats like the Evil Dominators and the Coons. Remember those guys? Yo, don't say their name wrong. [00:33:50] Speaker B: I don't remember them. [00:33:52] Speaker A: Yeah, those are the big baddies that look like Klingons. Okay, how do you not remember? [00:33:58] Speaker B: I don't remember. [00:34:01] Speaker A: Okay, you say that so genuinely that it seems like you really don't remember. [00:34:04] Speaker B: I don't remember. [00:34:07] Speaker A: Okay, well, it's been a long time other their. Other. Their other intergalactic races. Oh, yeah, yeah. [00:34:16] Speaker B: Huh. [00:34:17] Speaker A: Anyway, well, we get everybody together. Well, that's fine. We get everybody together and they start pushing through time. [00:34:27] Speaker B: Are they pushing like the. The time sphere? Is that the way to get it started? It's like an old, like B10 dotson. B10. They gotta, like, you know, push it to get it. They gotta rock it back and forth and then, you know, get to pop the clutch a little bit. [00:34:42] Speaker A: Kind of so basic. Basically. In this case, the time trapper said he's closing off time. Oh, and so Brainiac 5 builds a time bubble. Yeah, yeah. No, time Brainiac 5 builds a time bubble that he says can navigate through time, and he needs Monel to push it. [00:34:59] Speaker B: Hold on a second. I think I know who the timekeeper is. [00:35:08] Speaker A: That's not the Time Keeper. [00:35:10] Speaker B: Time Trapper. [00:35:13] Speaker A: A timekeeper for a long time was like Justin Roberts or like Howard Finkel. Okay, I think they were ring announcers too. Right, but didn't they also keep the time? [00:35:25] Speaker B: Yeah, no, but okay, Time trapper. Time trapper. Not timekeeper. [00:35:32] Speaker A: Is the time trapper. [00:35:33] Speaker B: Yes, Time trapper. Time trapper. Sounds like, oh, I'm thinking. Oh, okay, continue. [00:35:46] Speaker A: Okay, well, while you're thinking, it's, it's right there. While you're thinking all through the Silver and Bronze Age, Superboy. [00:35:54] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:55] Speaker A: Could just fly into the future by going super fast and going through time. And so Monel has the same powers because he's adapting. [00:36:04] Speaker B: Why doesn't he just do that? [00:36:06] Speaker A: That is what he's doing. [00:36:07] Speaker B: Oh my gosh. [00:36:08] Speaker A: So see on the top of page seven, those whenever you get these rainbow looking things means you're going through time. See it and it look it conveniently tells you. 29, 80, 29. [00:36:18] Speaker B: Sneaky. [00:36:19] Speaker A: 70, 29, 50, 29, 20, 28, 50, 2800. What's going on? Are they going backwards? [00:36:27] Speaker B: Going back? [00:36:28] Speaker A: I thought they were going forwards. [00:36:29] Speaker B: No, they're going backwards. They got to go back in time. [00:36:31] Speaker A: That I know. Trying to go forward. [00:36:33] Speaker B: The time tracker is a Renegade [00:36:38] Speaker A: now. Not the Renegade, no. [00:36:41] Speaker B: Oh, sure. [00:36:43] Speaker A: No, they're not controllers either. [00:36:47] Speaker B: Okay. [00:36:49] Speaker A: You just don't know anything about time in the DC Universe. [00:36:51] Speaker B: I don't know anything about time in the DC universe. [00:36:54] Speaker A: Now it'd be interesting if Rip Hunter was here. [00:36:57] Speaker B: I think he's the time Tracker, Time trapper, Timekeeper, Time. He's the time wrapper. He's, he's gonna come out and he's gonna be the John Cena, the, the Timeonomics. Easy to do a freestyle and put everybody. [00:37:23] Speaker A: Why don't read books with Silver Age villain names with Greg around. I, I just want to tell you. [00:37:33] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:37:34] Speaker A: Before I continue, we're on page seven, by the way. [00:37:37] Speaker B: Yes, page seven. [00:37:38] Speaker A: Everything's going crazy. They're trying to fly through time. I still don't have a definitive answer on whether it's at smart. Our pets are smart. [00:37:50] Speaker B: I know, Me neither. [00:37:52] Speaker A: It doesn't make sense for the rally. When does the, they had the rally. [00:37:56] Speaker B: Yeah. And that nobody got any answers. [00:37:59] Speaker A: When is the vice president going to tell them? [00:38:01] Speaker B: I, I, I, we gotta write some strongly worded. [00:38:05] Speaker A: Well, they were supposed he got a meeting. He got a meeting with the president of petsmart. I, I But have you seen the answer yet, though? I haven't seen. [00:38:14] Speaker B: We haven't seen the answer yet. So I mean, I'm still confused as is it, is it pet smart or pet smart? [00:38:30] Speaker A: I don't know. And it's very frustrating. [00:38:32] Speaker B: It is so frustrating. [00:38:33] Speaker A: It's like the X's in the Booster Gold logo. Why are they there? What do they mean? [00:38:37] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:38:38] Speaker A: Why are there three of them? [00:38:40] Speaker B: Yeah, why, why are they all there? Is Booster golden X man? What? [00:38:49] Speaker A: If that's a good question, that would be that. Well, is it X booster or is it X gold? [00:38:57] Speaker B: Excellent. Or is it three X's? So he's the triple X booster or triple X gold? [00:39:07] Speaker A: I think he's the triple X booster. [00:39:09] Speaker B: He's a triple X booster. He's boosting triple X's. [00:39:13] Speaker A: He had. He had a free pass to the video stores. Beaded curtain, back room. Oh, my gosh. [00:39:22] Speaker B: He's back there and he's like. He's got a backpack, and he's putting them all in there. And he's like, gotta get out of here real fast, everybody. [00:39:30] Speaker A: When he goes broke and he's not stealing time bubbles anymore, he's stealing porno. [00:39:35] Speaker B: Well, and then he. That's how he makes his money. Because he's like. He's like, I got an idea. I'm gonna take these movies. And this is in the 80s, right? So he's in the 80s. He's gonna go and he's gonna. He's gonna put out ads and he's gonna tell people that he will mail them these movies. All they have to do is give him a credit card, and then he'll charge them, and then he'll mail them the movie and they have to send it back and, like, you know, whenever they're done watching. [00:40:03] Speaker A: Well, the good news. The good news is because you paid $1.50. Well, I paid $1.50 for this book. Yeah. And it's direct sales only. There are no ads inside. [00:40:15] Speaker B: Oh. [00:40:16] Speaker A: They're only on the back. [00:40:17] Speaker B: On the back. [00:40:19] Speaker A: So that is kind of. That is one cool thing. If you paid the extra for the book, it's like paying extra per month for the streaming services. You got no ads in these books. [00:40:27] Speaker B: I get ads all the time because cheap. [00:40:30] Speaker A: So. Well, we flip to page eight, and we're at the end of time. And the time trapper is just standing there in his tattered purple robes, and he's like, Timeonomics. Well, he's a villain, so he doesn't have primary colors. [00:40:46] Speaker B: Oh, that makes sense. Yeah, he's just purple. [00:40:50] Speaker A: And he's like, marvelous. I warned cosmic boy that the next time the legionnaires entered the time stream, they would doom themselves and their century. And they have done so anyway. They are predictable fools. All I need to do is sit here and wait, and I win. For mine is the internal victory of Entropy. [00:41:11] Speaker B: Oh, so he's just playing a really big game. [00:41:13] Speaker A: Sorry. Yeah. But that is not rewarding enough. Yes. Let the Game I set in motion so long ago be concluded. This nefarious game. What has this person devised? What plot have they created simply to get rid of Superboy? The Time Trapper was thinking about this all the way since his very creation. Well, they're back in the time stream. The time bubble looks like it's being sliced up. [00:41:46] Speaker B: Oh, he says, how sublime. I thought he said, now sublime. [00:41:49] Speaker A: And I was like, how sublime? Not now sublime. [00:41:52] Speaker B: No, now sublime. [00:41:55] Speaker A: Was sublime playing in 1987? [00:41:58] Speaker B: You know, I'm pretty sure that, you know, they were all around, but I don't think they were playing. I think they were all young and learning to craft their music. [00:42:11] Speaker A: Well, they don't make it to the end of time. [00:42:13] Speaker B: They don't, sadly. Well, Bradley's end of time was suited the most. [00:42:21] Speaker A: Yeah, he doesn't have no crystal ball. [00:42:26] Speaker B: That's true. [00:42:27] Speaker A: He had a million dollars. [00:42:29] Speaker B: We spent it all. Yeah. Yeah. [00:42:32] Speaker A: So? Well, Mon El's trying to hold on to a crystal ball, and it's not going so well. [00:42:36] Speaker B: It is not going so well. He's breaking that ball. He's. [00:42:39] Speaker A: He's breaking it. He's a bob. And all of a sudden, all of a sudden, the time stream goes crazy. All the rainbow colors, like, spin around. They get jammed out. And Brainiac 5 is freaking out. He's like, Terrific. Which if Brainiac 5 says terrific, that's usually not a good thing. [00:43:00] Speaker B: Not a good thing. [00:43:00] Speaker A: Usually we. Usually a bad thing. [00:43:02] Speaker B: Is Brainiac 5 using sarcasm? [00:43:06] Speaker A: And. Yeah, he's. He's. He's crazy. By the way, we're gonna get one of the best. We're going to get one of the best pieces of art here. And it doesn't even relate to our main storyline. So we get Block, of course. [00:43:24] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:43:24] Speaker A: Just looking very Block. Like, it's like, forgive me, Brainiac, but I have never been able to fully grasp the human concept of time calculation. Is it not the end of time? Also the beginning? So if we've gone backwards, will we not reach our destination? Ah. So Block, as a silicon life form, believes in the loop of time. Loop of time. Now, there was another. There was another Legion villain called the Infinite Man. Yes. And he became formed by going through time over and over again. But the time trapper has always contended that time has an end. So there are actually two. There is two competing theories. And Block, of all people, gets the. The competing theory out for us. And only time is a lot can. Well, they. The time bubble is flying down, and Night girl says, oh, we're in Superboy's time. Right. And Brainiac's like, how could you possibly calculate this? And she looks at. She says, well, sometimes I just open my eyes because the time bubble is landing next to Smallville. Welcome to Smallville. Sign, home of Superboy. Ah, We get a splash page for a really disgusting subplot. So I'm not going to mention the subplot, but how about the art on this page, Greg? [00:44:45] Speaker B: It's pretty good. The art is like. I mean, it's really captivating, but it's kind of like it seems very dark. [00:44:59] Speaker A: It is very dark. I'll tell you about the subplot after the podcast. [00:45:01] Speaker B: But the. But the. The. When you flip over the page and you see this art, you're like, wow, there's, you know, like, there's all these things going on around the page, so you're drawn to different things. And then you're like, you know, obviously, [00:45:18] Speaker A: you know, it is Dream Girl in the middle of the page. Yeah. You got Dream Girl in the middle, and you've got Starboy's uniform in the background. And then things cut up in the foreground around Starboy's uniform. Do you catch that? So if you didn't read. And you got Starboy's face down in the corner too. Kind of. [00:45:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:45:39] Speaker A: And you've got a shadowy figure standing over her. That's presumably a Starboy. But we're not going to talk about the other character for now. I'm going to just leave that one alone, and I'll talk to you about whether or not we can talk about that after the podcast. Bears. [00:45:54] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:45:56] Speaker A: And we may not see it again in the next issue anyway, so may not be an issue. [00:45:59] Speaker B: Maybe not. [00:46:00] Speaker A: We're back in Smallville, usa. I love how the art flattens out to replicate the Silver Age. [00:46:09] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. It's very. Like, I. I was just. I was admiring that earlier. I was just like, wow. You know, they did a really good job at, like, taking it, toning it down and bringing it back to that. That feel of an older comic. [00:46:25] Speaker A: I really like the fact that Laroque can have the backgrounds like that, but still draw the characters in his current style. [00:46:32] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. Like each one of the characters. [00:46:33] Speaker A: So he doesn't flatten the characters out, but he flattens the backgrounds and the aesthetics and the vehicles and everything. Yeah. But the faces are all still very expressive. It's not a Curt Swan. It's not a Curt Swan Legion where you can just tell they're different characters because of the hair color change changes. Right. Yeah. Each one of these, they're still very distinct characters. [00:46:56] Speaker B: Well, yeah, even in their design, and they're in the way that they're standing and the way that they're formed as a character. Like, you can. They just have a. A really good, defined look about them. So that's great. [00:47:12] Speaker A: And then the. So we get four of them. So I guess some, not all of them, came in to Smallville. If you are a historian of comics, you will know that Mon El once appeared as Superboy's big brother. And he went around Smallville as Bob Cobb, brush salesman Bob Cobb. [00:47:35] Speaker B: Did he pick the name himself? [00:47:38] Speaker A: He did, I believe. I can't remember if Superboy picked his name or if he picked his name. Actually. I have to go read the issue. Ultra Boy also spent some time as one of his first missions, he was supposed to go figure out who Clark Kent was to join the Legion. [00:47:54] Speaker B: So how did they get back in time, Dan? [00:47:58] Speaker A: So we have a few of these characters have hung out. I do. The one thing I will say that I think is bad writing here is Night Girl just walks into the street and walks in front of a car and almost gets hit. And that's how they're introduced to Police Chief Parker. He's a small. But for four issues in a miniseries, Night Girl had just spent all this time in the 20th century with cosmic Boy. [00:48:29] Speaker B: So she knows about cars. [00:48:30] Speaker A: Be aware of cars. Yeah. Like, so they should have had one of the other characters do that. [00:48:35] Speaker B: That makes sense. Yeah. That's bad. [00:48:37] Speaker A: That is bad writing. [00:48:38] Speaker B: I would. I was. As someone who had not known. Had someone who had known, and just picking this book up and not knowing that precursor story, I was like, well, she might not have known. She just is like, you know, just walking around, she's doing her thing, and all of a sudden there's, like, a car there. She's like, oh, what's that? An elephant? I heard those things existed here in. In. [00:48:58] Speaker A: In. [00:48:59] Speaker B: In. In old Earth, in the old world. I also heard there was, you know, places like Sherry's Restaurant. [00:49:10] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. So I think the gag works, except it was the wrong character to do it with. [00:49:16] Speaker B: That's true. [00:49:17] Speaker A: So editorial. Missed a beat there. Karen Berger, one of the best, Ed. Even the best editors sometimes miss. [00:49:24] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:49:26] Speaker A: Well, we've got Pete Ross spots the Legion. Pete Ross, I was mentioning at the start of the broadcast. That's Clark Kent's best buddy. [00:49:34] Speaker B: He's also Pete Ross. Sauce boss. [00:49:37] Speaker A: Yeah. You. You know. No, he's not. You know that if you watch Smallville. [00:49:44] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:49:46] Speaker A: And Pete Ross's character eventually goes away. Yeah. Yeah, because he got mad because he didn't have enough screen time, so he left the show. Probably good, because it helped him avoid hanging out with a woman. Help being in a sex cult. So that's true. Maybe it's a show that was good to leave. We've got. Wow. [00:50:14] Speaker B: No. [00:50:16] Speaker A: Oh, we've get. We get as super. Anyway, Ross. Pete Ross identifies them, and he starts talking to them. He's like, oh, Ultra Boy is here. Yay. And then he says. And then Monel's like, buddy, are we glad to see you. And Ultra Boy is like, yeah, you're proof that everything's okay. And he's like, sure. Everything's been okay ever since Superboy saved us from those weird red skies and that energy wall. [00:50:48] Speaker B: Well. Oh, weird. [00:50:53] Speaker A: That sounds like a crisis. [00:50:56] Speaker B: Oh, man. [00:51:01] Speaker A: So, yeah, that is interesting. If all the other universes were destroyed. Yeah, but this one wasn't. That must mean that this is part of the main universe, right? [00:51:10] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [00:51:12] Speaker A: Because the only universe not destroyed in crisis was the main one. Right? [00:51:16] Speaker B: The main one, of course, yeah. Why? [00:51:19] Speaker A: We didn't have the Golden Age heroes anymore, right? [00:51:21] Speaker B: That's right. [00:51:23] Speaker A: Well, you didn't have some Golden Age heroes, right? [00:51:25] Speaker B: Some, but not all, right, because there [00:51:28] Speaker A: was only one Wonder Woman, right? After Crisis, there's only one of each character, right? You can only have one. Only there could be. Only one. Is like Highlander. [00:51:34] Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, yeah. So they went around and there was like, you know, they're like, we're gonna send a head chopper. He's going to get a big sword, and he's ch. One guy's got a katana. And then lightning comes out of the sky, right? [00:51:49] Speaker A: And you always have to start the movie with the fabulous free birds wrestling. [00:51:53] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, of course. Because that makes the most sense. [00:51:57] Speaker A: It does make the most sense. It always makes sense to start the [00:51:59] Speaker B: movie with the fabulous free birds wrestling. [00:52:04] Speaker A: 100%. Well, anyway, they're talking and they're like, red Scots. [00:52:11] Speaker B: Red Scots, yeah. [00:52:12] Speaker A: They thought judgment day was coming, man. They were super scared. And then we've got. Again, I don't. I think we're on character for this night. Girl's looking at the apples and she's like, oh, my God, there's fruit here. Even though she just lived in the past for, like, three months. Anyway, she gets a apple, and she's eating it, and she's like, is it delicious? [00:52:36] Speaker B: It's not delicious. This is a. [00:52:38] Speaker A: What. [00:52:38] Speaker B: What kind of apple is it? [00:52:40] Speaker A: The Macintosh. [00:52:41] Speaker B: Ah, See, It's a different apple. [00:52:42] Speaker A: Delicious. [00:52:43] Speaker B: Apples are totally different. [00:52:45] Speaker A: And Pete Ross says, I'm glad we. We may. Or no. Not. Not Pete. Sorry. Indistinguishable legionnaire because they're all in black. Says, I'm glad we made you an honorary legionnaire for guarding Superboy's secret identity. Since you accidentally discovered it, Pete, you make us feel right at home. [00:53:05] Speaker B: Oh, [00:53:08] Speaker A: and they say Cosmic Boy says, there's lots of good in ancient times we've lost as technology advanced. That's what got me interested in history, I think. [00:53:17] Speaker B: Hold on a second. I thought you said all legionnaires had to have a superpower before. Pete doesn't have a superpower. Except for this. [00:53:24] Speaker A: An honorary legionnaire. [00:53:26] Speaker B: Honorary Monterey. His super. [00:53:28] Speaker A: He's not a legionnaire. [00:53:29] Speaker B: His superpower. [00:53:30] Speaker A: Honorary legionnaire. [00:53:31] Speaker B: His superpower is truth. His superpower was knowing secret superpower is holding. Keeping secrets. [00:53:41] Speaker A: Well, they go to the Kent General Store. [00:53:44] Speaker B: Yes. [00:53:47] Speaker A: And the Kents look startled. [00:53:51] Speaker B: Oh, crap. [00:53:52] Speaker A: And the Legion is there. Ma is like, land sakes, Pa. Look, it's Mon El. And some of the legionnaires. And Pa's like, huh? [00:54:02] Speaker B: Oh, busted. [00:54:05] Speaker A: And Ultra Boy walks in. Hi, Mrs. Kent. Mr. Kent. Mr. Kent. Gosh, how you boys have grown. But why? And Ma's like, hush, Pa. So we get a little Kansas scenery here. [00:54:21] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [00:54:23] Speaker A: They're all happy to see each other. Now we go back to the 30th century and we get some action at the Science Police headquarters. Apparently, the Crime Watch system. That's the system that monitors crime all over the planet. That's why you only need a few science police. [00:54:42] Speaker B: Oh, that makes sense. [00:54:43] Speaker A: Sounds dystopian. Or could be dystopian. If bad things happen, you would get judges or weird stuff. [00:54:49] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, yeah. [00:54:51] Speaker A: Anyway, Officer Jaron is putting back the Crime Watch because he's probably the most incompetent science police officer. So you would have him do a very important job putting back. And we have Siobhan Aaron, who you'll recall from the one issue we read is also Sean Aaron. [00:55:14] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:55:14] Speaker A: Yes. In a very controversial story. But. And it's not the controversy here, and everything's normal. Normal? I didn't say that. Everything's fine. [00:55:28] Speaker B: Everything's fine. [00:55:29] Speaker A: Yeah. And then we get Morella Tao shows up, and you're like, who is this? This is a subplot that I don't even know if they fully resolve. [00:55:41] Speaker B: Okay, cool. [00:55:44] Speaker A: Levitz, you love to plop the little subplots in here and then go back to other parts of the story. Gotcha and then we get Flip in the page to Legion headquarters and Phantom Girl, sad because she's not with Ultra Boy. And Shadow Last is sad because she's not with Mon El. Mm. And then Shrinking Violet comes in and makes fun of them, and they're like, oh, but you used to date Duplicate Boy. And she's like, ha, ha. I outgrew my mistake. And one of the continuing indicators that. One of the continuing indicators that Levin never gets to come out and directly say, until the 2000 teens that shrinking violet is bisexual or lesbian. So. But it's. This is. If you've been reading the subtext along. It's continued. It's continuing that subtext, which is cool. [00:56:43] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:56:43] Speaker A: I wish, obviously. I wish they could have been allowed to actually just say it, do that with the character. But it's also. It's also indications that they picked up on. Later in the storytelling. It gets picked up on. I mentioned in the Five Years Later Legion as well. [00:57:00] Speaker B: Oh. [00:57:01] Speaker A: Where she's basically having a relationship with. With Lightning Lass. But they can't quite say it. But they're hanging out together on a planet naked, but they can't say it. And then in the retro boot Legion, eventually, when Levitz is writing again, they just, like, on a page, just pop out. Out of their bedroom together. Yeah. So then was a. [00:57:27] Speaker B: Then. [00:57:28] Speaker A: It's. It's. It's. It's. That's what it is. Yeah. Well. And it's just. It's for. I would say it's fortunate and unfortunate. I mean, most of the. Again, if you're reading it, you're keying in on this. But if you just pick up, yeah, this book, you'd read this page and be like, yeah, what? Okay. They're just, you know, being catty. But, yeah, you're getting the subtext. And then also Dawnstar and Wildfire have been trained to date forever. You'll notice Wildfire's costume a bit different here. Yeah. He was taught by another character named Quizlet how to take his energy and shape it into forms. And this is the first time Dawnstar has seen that. And since they're not going to address that in this issue, they're going to introduce it right now for a future issue, as Rabbit likes to do. So you've got several plot threads picked up. You've got some stuff going on between the science police officers. Marilla Tao, who was dating Sunboy. Gigi Cusimano used to date Sunboy. I think everybody used to date Sunboy there. That's. That's what that's all about. Down in the corner. [00:58:33] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:58:33] Speaker A: They're gonna dish the tea. And you get the plot line with. Potential plot line. If he was. Would have been allowed to pick it up with. With Shrinking Violet. And then you obviously, obviously get the other plot line here. So one of the things. And it was not everything would always get resolved, which I think worked out okay. But it was. It was neat how Levitt would just drop these things in here that he. These threads he could grab. And I know you've mentioned that about in your stories too, that you will intentionally leave some threads to be grabbed later. [00:59:05] Speaker B: Got you. [00:59:06] Speaker A: I mean, if you want to. [00:59:07] Speaker B: And that's the thing that I like. I mean, that I definitely like about these stories. Like, you know, you've. You've pointed out. And then I've picked up on as we've been reading these Legion books and stuff like that here and there, all over the place is that there's that type of thing for readers to pick up on as they're. As they're enjoying the story. And then there's like, little things that make you. Oh, what's. What's this about? And makes you want to read other. Other portions of the story through other books because it's leaving you breadcrumb. Breadcre breadcrumbs for those characters. [00:59:43] Speaker A: When it also built, you know, you had a fandom now that was. And Legion came out in 58. [00:59:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:59:49] Speaker A: So this is 87. So you have 30 years of. Almost 30 years of fandom. It's. You've got a very strong, dedicated fandom for Legion. And so you. You've got, you know, the Amateur Press Association. There was two of them, two Legion Amateur Press association publications. There's a lot of fan support that had kept the Legion going. Of course, you're, you know, getting into America Online and Prodigy coming up in the next few years. So you get those kind of phantoms. You get Usenet fandom. Yeah. Chat rooms. But, you know, these things too. Sparked things. Right. So it. Ha. That's where you get. And even this book that I was holding, right. You get these, you know, whole books full of articles about the Legion and theories about it. And this one is more of an academic book. It's like, how did the Legion impact certain things? Or how did the storytelling work? I wouldn't call it an academic book. It's a. It's a. This is a fun book. [01:00:46] Speaker B: It's a fun book. But who says academia can't be fun? Or things that. Things that review what we View as fun can't be intellectually stimulating. And I think a book like that, [01:01:01] Speaker A: of course, I turn around. Yeah. But I think. [01:01:03] Speaker B: I think a book like that definitely is intellectually stimulating and. And. And draws that type of conversation out from people that don't. Normally, you would enjoy these things, these comic books. Oh, these comic books. But there's so much more there. Even like you were talking about with subtext to stories, there's so much more there when you peel back the layers. And I think over time, people have seen that, cataloged it, put it together, and then were able to put it into other books. [01:01:40] Speaker A: Interviews with creators. Yeah. Yes. It's got a. You know, it's a. It's the type of. Let me turn back to the microphone and talk and not away from it. It's the type of fandom that was creative and loved these characters, and there are so many of them, too. And of course, people say, well, that's a disadvantage of Legion. There's too many characters, it's not accessible. And it's like, Right. But also all these threads, people pick up on them and they can go, right, oh, well, this is why. This is why this happened. And this is why this happened. So, you know, in the case of Shrinking Violet, she was dating somebody. She just happened to be dating a boyfriend that lived galaxies away. I mean, not galaxies, but, yeah. Solar systems. Far enough away and so conveniently. And only saw them every once in a while. Right. So hardly in the picture. And then suffers a very traumatic event of being kidnapped and put in a sensory deprivation for like a year. And he comes out of that and is basically like, yeah, I'm living my truth now. [01:02:47] Speaker B: Oh, I don't need to. [01:02:51] Speaker A: Yeah, she went and got super strong. She started, you know, she got super strong. She started practicing more martial arts, and she became very independent, but also, you know, starts living her truth. And. And again, you know, as fandom gets to speculate, it would have been neat if the 80s had allowed us to let that expression fully express itself in the comics. But fandom picked up on it and then. And built on it. Right? Yeah. And so. And then you get the reveal from the writer later that that is very much what they intended all along. So in that case, fandom and the writer were aligned, but that's not always the case. [01:03:30] Speaker B: Right? Not always the case. [01:03:31] Speaker A: The writer and fandom are not aligned at all. And that's okay, too. [01:03:35] Speaker B: But sometimes writers write things in a way that if people are picking it up and, you know, if you're writing a Cast of characters that's 20 deep. And you write a couple different characters in a way that if someone is reading through that subtext of stuff, it's accessible for them if they know what they're looking for. And that's what's not accessible for other people. It might not matter because it's not for them. [01:04:06] Speaker A: It also allows a future writer to pick that up too. [01:04:09] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [01:04:11] Speaker A: If you drop these threads, a future writer can pick up and pull that thread and then make it a big thing. Yeah. [01:04:17] Speaker B: Make better stories out of those. Out of those breadcrumbs. That's. That's fantastic. [01:04:23] Speaker A: Well, we flipped the page here, and we're back in Smallville, usa. [01:04:27] Speaker B: Oh, my goodness. And the Kent's house is bigger than it has ever been before. [01:04:33] Speaker A: Yeah, it's. It's pretty standard size. [01:04:36] Speaker B: I. I'm just. It just looks. [01:04:37] Speaker A: I was. I was about to say it looks pretty much like the Kent house. We get. They're all sitting at the table, and Ma Kent's telling them, move the potatoes around. And Claw's looking really nervous. He's like, look at you, cosmic boy. You've all grown up since that day. You came here to invite Clark to join the Legion in the future. That would be the very first appearance of Legion of Superheroes in Adventure Comics 247. [01:05:04] Speaker B: Oh, wow. [01:05:06] Speaker A: When they invite Superboy to come to the future. [01:05:08] Speaker B: Come to the future with us. You're gonna have a blast. It's gonna be great. We got apples. [01:05:14] Speaker A: And then Clark appears, and they're all worried about him, and they all surround him, and Clark's like, hey, come to my basement. Let's talk. [01:05:28] Speaker B: That's not unusual. [01:05:30] Speaker A: Well, in this case it's not, because that's where Superboy's hangout was, but. Yeah. [01:05:34] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:05:36] Speaker A: And then you get a really cool shot on page 19 for Superboy. Superboy always had these. Had these little miniature figures. And sometimes when the Legion needed him, one of the figures would flash. [01:05:53] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [01:05:55] Speaker A: So he always kept those there. And depending on the era and time, it was always neat, too, because these figures used to change kind of their suits based on who was drawing it and what the time frame of the Legion was. [01:06:06] Speaker B: That's cool. [01:06:07] Speaker A: So it was interesting. You'll see here that some of these aren't up to date. And some of them are. Though the weirdest one to me is that there's no Sensor Girl. There's none of the new Legionnaires. So Polar boy, you notice? No Polar Boy. [01:06:23] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:06:24] Speaker A: No Sensor Girl, no Telus. No Magnetic Kid, which is Cosmic Boy's younger brother. And no Telus or I mean, no Quizlet, the character I was just telling you about. [01:06:36] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:06:36] Speaker A: So the five characters that joined after Crisis. This is a clue thing. You wouldn't. You wouldn't pick up on this because you wouldn't know that. But the. The five characters that join after Crisis. Not here. [01:06:49] Speaker B: Well, he hasn't collected them yet. [01:06:52] Speaker A: And also, Starboy had quit and he's still here. And Princess Projector is Sensor Girl. So she's there, but not as the character, the person she is now. So that's kind of where you're placing this in time. It's almost like time for Superboy stops at the red skies. [01:07:14] Speaker B: Okay, interesting. [01:07:17] Speaker A: At least implied by this. [01:07:18] Speaker B: Okay, fair. [01:07:21] Speaker A: I guess we do have some dead legionnaires here. [01:07:24] Speaker B: Where's Karate Key? [01:07:26] Speaker A: He's back there in the back. [01:07:27] Speaker B: I know. That's. I see. I said there's Karate Kid. [01:07:32] Speaker A: Yeah, like I said, there's some dead ones here too. [01:07:34] Speaker B: Yeah, we like the dead ones, but I mean, [01:07:40] Speaker A: well, all the legionnaires are looking at the statuettes. They said they forgot about them. He said they. We look impressive like that all together. They haven't picked up on. There's some missing yet, though. And then it looks like Superboy has grabbed the Phantom Zone Projector. It's a big flashlight, but it's not. Yeah, it does look like it's the Phantom Zone Projector. Doesn't it, though? [01:08:03] Speaker B: Yeah, kind of. [01:08:06] Speaker A: He grabs it and he's like, sorry, friends. And he freezes them. [01:08:11] Speaker B: Oh, that jerk. He's gonna make them tiny and put him inside his little display. He's the projector collector. [01:08:20] Speaker A: No, he's not, Brainiac. Okay, but Pa comes downstairs and he's like, did you paralyze them? And he's like, yes, Pa. They said four more legionnaires were hiding the time bubble near the town line. [01:08:35] Speaker B: Oh, man. [01:08:38] Speaker A: He starts to change into a Superboy suit, and then Lana shows up. [01:08:44] Speaker B: Oh, man. [01:08:44] Speaker A: In classic Silver Age fashion. [01:08:46] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:08:48] Speaker A: And she's ready to do homework. And Ma is shocked. And Clark has to not be Superboy, and he has to help her with her algebra so she never finds out that he is Superboy. [01:09:00] Speaker B: Oh, man. [01:09:02] Speaker A: And we flip the page, we go back to the future, and Element Lad is talking to Polar Boy. Okay, I. If I'm gonna venture to guess, we found the page with the Arnie Star inks. [01:09:14] Speaker B: Ah, yeah, yeah. You think? [01:09:17] Speaker A: Look at it. [01:09:18] Speaker B: I know. [01:09:21] Speaker A: Look at Element Lad in the top. [01:09:23] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. [01:09:27] Speaker A: Like What? Element Lad was always drawn thin. Yeah, I don't know how he got full. Anyway, he's been juicing. I think we found part of the Arnie Star Inks. No offense, Arnie. [01:09:40] Speaker B: Ellen. Lads, been on the Juice. [01:09:42] Speaker A: This is clearly the worst panel in the entire book. I mean, very much so. Like, it is not a good panel. [01:09:52] Speaker B: It's not good. [01:09:53] Speaker A: But just to summarize there, Polar Boy is all nervous about being the new leader and this crisis is happening. And Element Labs trying to pump him up and make him feel better, he's like, look, even Dream Girl did a good job when she was leader. You can do a good job. [01:10:08] Speaker B: Even you can do a good job. [01:10:10] Speaker A: And then he shares that he would have also made the same decision Polar Boy did. And Polar Boy takes a breath, relaxes for a second. We go back to the outskirts of Smallville, and we've got. We've got a team there. We're going to line this team up. Are you ready? Okay, we've got Mr. Fantastic. [01:10:31] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:10:31] Speaker A: The Thing, the Torch, and the Invisible Girl. [01:10:35] Speaker B: Okay. [01:10:38] Speaker A: I mean, we have Brainiac 5, Block, Sunboy, and Invisible Kid. [01:10:43] Speaker B: Okay. [01:10:46] Speaker A: This will become important soon. Okay? John Byrne never drew Fantastic Four, did he? [01:10:55] Speaker B: Oh, hey, wait a minute. [01:10:59] Speaker A: Oh, oh, okay. Well, Pete shows up. They're all talking, and Pete shows up and is like, you guys gotta run. Go, go, go. They were screaming and nobody came out. And they're like, pete, is it okay? And he's like, yeah, if a monster is strong enough to attack Superboy, Mono, and Ultra Boy, you guys better leave. They're like, okay, you're right. We're going to. And they, they, they get in the Thing. Pete Ross runs away, Superboy flies after them with the stasis Zapper thing. You get a really cool. Panels of Sunboy, Invisible Kid, Block, and. And Brainiac 5, all looking scared and concerned as Superboy comes after them and they break into the time barrier. And they're like, what was he doing? Why was he aiming this thing at us? Oh, by the way, we're at page 25. You also got a couple of extra pages for your $50 cents. [01:11:55] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [01:11:56] Speaker A: And then it's Smallville. Superboy saying it's awful or thinking it's awful. But I have no alternative. The Earth, Smallville, maybe the whole universe is depending on me. I won't let you down, Mapa. I'll save you. Even if it means I have to track the legionnaires through time until I trapped each and every one of them. [01:12:15] Speaker B: Oh, man. [01:12:16] Speaker A: Future, here I come. And at the end of time, I've given them all hard their hearts desires. The Legion found their treasured past. Superboy may have his little world, but as soon as they take their gifts, they shall find them. They have destroyed time itself. [01:12:33] Speaker B: Oh, no. [01:12:34] Speaker A: Let me bring all the players in play together for the final act. When it's done, all will be dust, and the time Trapper shall rule eternity. [01:12:46] Speaker B: That Trapper. [01:12:48] Speaker A: And next issue, Superman 8 Future Shock. On sale next week, then the week after Action Comics591. And then in one month, the finale in legion of superheroes 38. [01:13:00] Speaker B: Oh, my. [01:13:06] Speaker A: Wow. [01:13:08] Speaker B: Wow. [01:13:09] Speaker A: What do you think so far? [01:13:10] Speaker B: Oh, I pretty a pretty good story. Like, I mean, it's, it's engaging. It's got me, like, wanting. Okay, I'm. I'm interested. I want to know what's going to happen because, you know, why a Superboy. What's going. What, what, what's making him do this? Why? Yeah, you know, did something happen? What? We got to find out what happened before to make him this way now. And hopefully that's going to be explained or we're gonna get a little. A little glimpse at that. But. And then will the other Legionnaires be able to escape Superboy as he goes full Terminator mode? [01:14:01] Speaker A: I hope so. [01:14:02] Speaker B: It sounds like it's. It's like he's going to show up. He's going to travel forward in time, and then he's going to get there and all his clothes are going to be, like, burned off because he's going to fly so fast, and he's going to, like, land on the ground, and he's going to be like, give me your clothes. And some guy's going to be like, okay, fine. He's going to give him his clothes, and then he's like, give me your bike. And, you know, jump on his motorcycle and take off. And he's like, wait a minute, I don't need a motorcycle. And then he'll jump off the motorcycle and let it, like, crash into a building and he'll, like, fly away. Hasta la vista. [01:14:40] Speaker A: I have no idea what you're talking about right now. [01:14:42] Speaker B: He's gonna go full Terminator mode, Dan. [01:14:45] Speaker A: But I was looking up the next issue. [01:14:47] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:14:49] Speaker A: So if you were curious, that's. This was. Oh, he does Fantastic Four. Fantastic4 Number 249. [01:14:57] Speaker B: Okay, so look, that cover. [01:14:58] Speaker A: Where, Where? Yeah, so where the guard. What's his name? [01:15:05] Speaker B: The Guardian. [01:15:06] Speaker A: Is it Guardian? [01:15:07] Speaker B: No. Right, The Guardians from the. The Guardian is a D.C. character. [01:15:12] Speaker A: No, it's The. It's the Galactic Guardians, the Shia. [01:15:17] Speaker B: The Shia. [01:15:18] Speaker A: What's his name? The super. This. I should know this. The Superman and the Shiara, created by Dave Cochran. [01:15:23] Speaker B: Okay. [01:15:25] Speaker A: You know what I'm talking about. The X Men. [01:15:28] Speaker B: The X Men. [01:15:30] Speaker A: The Shi'. [01:15:30] Speaker B: Ar. Yeah. [01:15:31] Speaker A: X Men. Lilandra. [01:15:34] Speaker B: Okay. [01:15:35] Speaker A: Imperial Guard in this book in X Men. [01:15:40] Speaker B: Okay. [01:15:41] Speaker A: Imperial Guard, created by Dave Cockrum. [01:15:43] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:15:44] Speaker A: Through Legion. Who drew Superboy. [01:15:46] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. The. [01:15:48] Speaker A: His name is Guardian, right? [01:15:50] Speaker B: Oh, oh, okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That has like the powers that. Like, he's like a space pirate. Yeah. [01:15:57] Speaker A: As the powers of Superman. [01:15:59] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. He's basically like. And he's also like a space pirate. [01:16:03] Speaker A: Yes. But he's not. Well, it's Imperial Guard. They defend the Shiar. [01:16:07] Speaker B: Yeah. They defend the Shi'. [01:16:09] Speaker A: Ar. [01:16:09] Speaker B: But then, like, I mean, they end up like a. He ends up like a space pirate. [01:16:14] Speaker A: Because anyways, yes, he fights. He fights Fantastic Four. And the COVID is the same as this. [01:16:22] Speaker B: I see. [01:16:23] Speaker A: I want to do a side by side to draw. He got to draw fake Superman. [01:16:29] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:16:31] Speaker A: And then he gets to draw a real Superman fighting fake Fantastic Four. So that. That's where all that went from. So he recreates the COVID Anybody is curious. And that's what we get. This is the next issue, so next podcast, just so you all can keep up. We were going to do this for four weeks, but we're not because Dan reread issue eight and like, half of issue eight is a recap of this issue. [01:16:57] Speaker B: Oh, spoiler. [01:16:59] Speaker A: Yeah, spoiler. So we're gonna do Superman number eight next time, and we're gonna do Action Comics 591. [01:17:06] Speaker B: Now I got to read two books. [01:17:08] Speaker A: You got to read two books. But it should go quick because a lot of this is a repeat of the last book. You just. [01:17:14] Speaker B: That means that I'm reading down that. That means that I'm reading three books. If it's. If. If. The second book that I. The first book that I had to read is mostly the first book, so I have to read now Books one, again, Books Two, and now Books three. So that's three books, Dan, [01:17:33] Speaker A: you know, it seems like. It seems like a chore for you, but I think you'll manage. [01:17:36] Speaker B: It is. [01:17:37] Speaker A: I did also want to let you know. Yeah, I just won a tournament. [01:17:43] Speaker B: Holy crap. Everybody. Damn. What a tournament. Yeah. All right. [01:17:48] Speaker A: Yeah. So I. I didn't want to alert you to that. See, I just let the tournament go. I didn't have to do any baseball playing. My skills are so strong. I can set it all up before the podcast and be successful. [01:18:04] Speaker B: Congratulations. You did good. You're, it's, you're like Toyota, Chevrolet at the Oscars. [01:18:11] Speaker A: Yep. But sinners should have won. That's all I have to say. Yes, that's, that's, that's all I'm gonna say. I, the, the last thing I need in life is another Leonardo DiCaprio movie winning anything. [01:18:32] Speaker B: Yeah. Yay. [01:18:35] Speaker A: I mean, at least Michael B. Jordan won the best actor Oscar. But honestly, too. And no shade on Michael B. Jordan. I didn't think that his, his acting was very good in the film, but I felt it was like the message of the film and the way they carry out the film is what, why it was best picture. I don't know if any of the acting performances were best actor worthy, if that makes sense in that film. I think it's when you take the whole team and you execute the way they did. And obviously now here's where Michael B. Jordan can be best actor because he played two characters. Granted, they were brothers and they look the same, but he plays two characters in the film, so yes, I mean, give him the nod for the work. [01:19:19] Speaker B: Wait a minute. Played the same guy, playing this different guy. [01:19:24] Speaker A: They were brothers. Have you watched it, have you watched Sinners? [01:19:27] Speaker B: I haven't watched any of the movies that are nominated for the Oscars. [01:19:31] Speaker A: You and Anne need to watch it. It's really good. [01:19:34] Speaker B: Are we Sinners? [01:19:35] Speaker A: You don't even know what it's about. I'm actually sad that you didn't watch it. It is a really good movie. [01:19:41] Speaker B: I, I, I was basically when a [01:19:43] Speaker A: lot of stuff, you know, it's a, you know, it's a sci fi movie kind of. Right. [01:19:47] Speaker B: I, I understand. I, I get the concept of it. No, I, I hear, I hear, I hear good things about it and I want to see it, but I just know, like, when it, when a lot of these movies came out earlier this year, I was not in a place to watch movies, so. And I just haven't taken time, I [01:20:05] Speaker A: haven't taken time to do it now. I did watch it on an airplane the first time and then had to go back and watch it on my bigger screen at home. No, I watched it on my tablet on an airplane. [01:20:13] Speaker B: Yeah, but I was going to say, [01:20:14] Speaker A: like, watching it after watching it on the airplane on my tablet, I had to watch it on my big tv. Watch. It's really good. [01:20:20] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:20:21] Speaker A: Because it's visually awesome too. [01:20:23] Speaker B: I'm sure it'll be something that I can, I can talk her into watching. [01:20:26] Speaker A: Haunting. It's. It's. Anyway, it's a good film. I do need to watch the one that won so I can make a judgment call. But anyway, we have talked for an hour and 20 minutes, so I don't want to get too far into Oscar talk. [01:20:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:20:38] Speaker A: But next week, we will continue the. We will get to see some things. Number one, I'm going to send you a link right now. Michael Grabois, the guy I mentioned that said that Legion editorial was the greatest villain. He has a blog called the Legion of Super Bloggers, and he wrote a whole issue, a whole page back in 2015 on who drew it better. [01:21:05] Speaker B: Oh, okay. [01:21:07] Speaker A: And so he's comparing legion of Supers 37 versus Superman number eight. [01:21:12] Speaker B: Okay. [01:21:12] Speaker A: And asking you to be the judge who drew it better. Greg LaRocque and Mike DeCarlo. Or one John Byrne. Now, here's where I will say it's not completely fair because this is on the Baxter paper. [01:21:30] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:21:31] Speaker A: And this is on standard comic newsprint paper. [01:21:34] Speaker B: Yeah. So it's. [01:21:35] Speaker A: It's colors on this. See, when you look at it, you kind of have to ignore the coloring. Yeah. [01:21:41] Speaker B: But it's hard not to because it looks so good. I mean, anything compared to Leon, like when you compare regular comic book paper [01:21:47] Speaker A: to Baxter Paper, it is. It's hard. And of course, the answer is Steve Lytle. [01:21:54] Speaker B: Steve Lytle always had the best page, for sure. Yeah. Best page for sure. [01:22:00] Speaker A: Top. I mean, [01:22:04] Speaker B: I mean, I've already seen that cover before on the Superman book. I've already seen that before. [01:22:14] Speaker A: Yeah. So I do think. Well, yeah, I. I do think best page is. Is this. I mean, the Steve Lytle cover. [01:22:23] Speaker B: Yeah, that. That is. That is great. I mean, comparatively, pulling up both covers. I mean, like, I mean, I've seen it done before. I don't need to see it on there. [01:22:31] Speaker A: I mean, but then the John Burns Superboy fighting Superman. Oh, yeah. In action is. I think this is a. I think this is a better cover. I know this one is more iconic. [01:22:42] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:22:43] Speaker A: Because it's a copy cover. [01:22:44] Speaker B: Right. [01:22:44] Speaker A: But this is a better cover than this one. [01:22:46] Speaker B: You know, it'd be cool is if you were to go get that. So you to take. Take. You take that John Byrne and then you have him remarket, as with the Fantastic Four characters over the [01:23:05] Speaker A: look, I don't think John Byrne will ever speak to me. If I did get to talk to John Byrne, though, I would have. I mean, look, I'd have so many questions, not just about this, but about, like, what he did at Marvel. Like, you know, I've gotten, you know, articles. I want the real truth here. [01:23:24] Speaker B: Right. [01:23:24] Speaker A: Like he says, oh, in, you know, in these articles he's all conciliatory, like, oh, well, you know, I wanted to leave this because people have been so critical. I'm critical too. But I would also. It's just because it hurt my favorite comic. Right. Like, was it good for the DC universe? We've talked about this before. Was it good for the DC universe to re establish Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman and the Flash and then eventually Green Lantern. Right. Was it good for them to establish those core. Or is it good for them to continually stay in sales behind Marvel and have Teen Titan, new Teen Titans and Legion be their top selling books? I think there's probably an argument that if you are a business. Yeah. You would want the first thing. Right. You want your, your five key IPS to the most successful one. Where I think the flaw in that thinking though is you also have to be willing to move forward with time. And even though the Legion had been around a long time at that point. [01:24:29] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:24:30] Speaker A: Legion is one of the top selling books. You don't throw away a newer, fresher thing to reestablish an old thing. And I think, you know, that's one of the things DC found out now with the absolute line. [01:24:46] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:24:46] Speaker A: Is that they are taking concepts that existed before, but redoing those concepts and then those books became very hot. Right. Because you're taking. So. And that's interesting too. Of course Marvel did it with Ultimates, but you could argue that now. Now here's another. I'm not going to get too far into this because we could go another hour, but Legion already did that with the Legion relaunch in the 90s with the Archie Legion was the first test of ultimate because you relaunch, you just didn't have the other book alongside of it. Right. But you relaunch Legion at zero. You start them again as teenagers. [01:25:24] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:25:25] Speaker A: And then you go from there. And that's basically what Ultimate Spider man did and Ultimate X Men and all that did. Right. And then you know, you have the absolutes that relaunches the heroes and does that so those things can be successful. Are they sustainable long term? Ultimate, ultimate, was it ultimately not. Legion flamed out at a point. I don't necessarily think it needed to, but Mark Wade wanted to redo it and so you know, they canceled that line. But. And you know, Legion ends with Legion lost and then has like 30 more issues with Abnet and Lanning ultimate just ends with Ultimate Fallout. Right. And then it went away, and now Marvel was trying to relaunch it. Right. [01:26:12] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:26:14] Speaker A: I mean, you know, the new launches have a sort of a shelf life to an extent, but, you know, you have that. But there's no need to relaunch at ultimate too. If you're continuing on good stories that writers and good artists, good stuff, then why that are selling. [01:26:31] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:26:31] Speaker A: And so it just. It is. As much as I want to, you know, I'm sympathetic to the argument that, like, oh, well, Byrne didn't really want all that to happen or whatever, but the effect of restarting Superman and not doing like an ultimate Superman or an absolute Superman, but restarting the Superman universe there impacts everything that Superman touches. Right. So if you wanted to do a brand new Superman, then why not do a brand new Superman and set it off to the side and let the current go? [01:27:05] Speaker B: Just have it do its thing while you've got this other Superman doing his other thing. [01:27:12] Speaker A: Right. And that way you don't mess up all these other things and all these threads. Because, again, you can't have a Legion of Superheroes without a Superboy, can you? [01:27:21] Speaker B: He wanted it to be his whole thing, his whole enchilada. And then he. [01:27:28] Speaker A: Well, and we're gonna. Yeah, and we're gonna transition to that whole enchilada next issue. So you're gonna get John Byrne drawing Superman and drawing Legion of Superheroes. So, yeah, on that note, we should wrap this thing up. We mentioned Jiu Jitsu Lawyer Paul. I don't have the number handy today. Oh, that's a number next week. But if you need Jiu Jitsu Lawyer Paul's support, just like the Squacho man is getting. Oh, you can reach out to Jiu Jitsu Lawyer Paul and also Retro Emporium. Relive your childhood. We like that place. And of course, you could get a copy of Absolute Zero's Camp Launchpad. [01:28:07] Speaker B: You can. [01:28:10] Speaker A: And it's Greg's book. [01:28:11] Speaker B: Yeah, apparently. [01:28:12] Speaker A: And eventually. Future Greg books. [01:28:14] Speaker B: Yeah, [01:28:17] Speaker A: future Greg. Future Greg books. And of course, there'll be a link to the Kickstarter that will start incredibly [01:28:23] Speaker B: soon once it gets a kick to get started. It'll kick start the starting of kicking. [01:28:32] Speaker A: Right. Eventually, you will get a link to the Kickstarter for the Legion of Alexes and their long reigns. [01:28:43] Speaker B: And their long reigns. Yes. [01:28:45] Speaker A: A cyborg story. [01:28:48] Speaker B: The rain. [01:28:48] Speaker A: In the 30th century. [01:28:49] Speaker B: Yes, in the 30th century. Let there be correct. [01:28:55] Speaker A: Yes, Check that out. There's going to be a link. There's a link every week, and eventually, if you click that link, you can sub follow. Like, you can set it to where it will tell you when it launches. Someday in 2029, it will launch. [01:29:13] Speaker B: It'll be sooner than that for sure. Yeah, I know. [01:29:25] Speaker A: Okay, and on that note, I think it's time to end the podcast. [01:29:27] Speaker B: Time to end. Yes. We'll be back next time with more Legion. More Superman or Legion more Superman? [01:29:36] Speaker A: More destruction of things are great. [01:29:38] Speaker B: Boy, it'll be Super Dan. [01:29:44] Speaker A: Bye, Crypto. [01:29:45] Speaker B: Crypto. Bye bye.